The Big Picture

‘28 Years Later: The Bone Temple’ Is Gut-Ripping and Gut-Wrenching. Plus: Mona Fastvold on ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’!

January 16, 2026

Key Takeaways Copied to clipboard!

  • The hosts and Chris Ryan thoroughly enjoyed Nia DaCosta's film, *28 Years Later: The Bone Temple*, praising its visceral horror, visual language, and thematic depth as a strong second installment in the trilogy. 
  • Ralph Fiennes' performance in *28 Years Later: The Bone Temple* is highlighted as daring, flexible, and central to the film's success, particularly in his dynamic scenes with Jack O'Connell's villainous Jimmy Crystal. 
  • The hosts were surprised by the ambitious structure and musical/choreographic elements of *The Testament of Ann Lee*, noting Amanda Seyfried's transformative performance and the film's non-judgmental portrait of the radical Shaker movement. 
  • Mona Fastvold intentionally crafted 'The Testament of Ann Lee' as a serious, non-ironic portrait of Ann Lee, integrating Shaker music and ecstatic dance through choreography and sound design that is inseparable from the diegetic world. 
  • The film's ambitious, epic scope on a lower budget was achieved through creative necessity, including the use of traditional matte painting techniques combined with modern VFX to evoke a painterly, handmade aesthetic. 
  • Amanda Seyfried delivered 'God tier work' in 'The Testament of Ann Lee,' successfully navigating the immense demands of portraying a complex spiritual leader who must sing, dance, lead, and endure extreme physical and emotional trauma without the director winking at the audience. 

Segments

Podcast Ad Reads
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(00:00:00)
  • Key Takeaway: Disney Plus is promoting the new Marvel series Wonder Man starring Yahya Abdul-Mateen II and Ben Kingsley, streaming January 27th.
  • Summary: The episode opens with an advertisement for Disney Plus promoting the upcoming series Wonder Man, which features Von Kovac coming out of retirement to redefine the superhero genre. The series stars Yahya Abdul-Mateen II as Simon Williams/Wonder Man and Ben Kingsley. Intuit TurboTax is also advertised, directing users to turbotax.com/slash local for local tax experts.
Episode Introduction and Guests
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(00:01:10)
  • Key Takeaway: The episode features a breakdown of 28 Years Later: The Bone Temple with Chris Ryan and an interview with Mona Fastvold regarding The Testament of Ann Lee.
  • Summary: Hosts Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins introduce the main topics: Nia DaCosta’s 28 Years Later: The Bone Temple with Chris Ryan, and Mona Fastvold’s The Testament of Ann Lee, a biopic musical about the Shaker leader Ann Lee. The hosts express high regard for The Testament of Ann Lee, noting Amanda Seyfried’s central performance.
iHeart Award Nomination Note
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(00:02:18)
  • Key Takeaway: The Big Picture podcast has been nominated for Best TV and Film Podcast by the iHeart Podcast Awards.
  • Summary: The hosts announce their nomination for the iHeart Podcast Awards in the Best TV and Film Podcast category. They briefly joke about the logistics of who receives credit for the nomination among the production team, including themselves, Chris Ryan, and producer Jack Sanders.
College Football Transfer News
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(00:03:54)
  • Key Takeaway: Quarterback Dante Moore is returning to Oregon despite the recent acquisition of transfer Dylan Raiola.
  • Summary: The conversation briefly pivots to college football news, noting Dante Moore’s decision to return to Oregon after the team secured quarterback Dylan Raiola from Nebraska. Sean expresses concern about the Jets drafting an underdeveloped young quarterback, preferring they wait for a prospect like Arch Manning.
Personal Anecdotes and NFL Coaching Changes
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(00:06:48)
  • Key Takeaway: Jets offensive coordinator Kevin Petullo has reportedly been demoted amidst fan speculation regarding Brian Daboll’s coaching decisions.
  • Summary: Sean shares personal tangents, including contemplating getting his ears pierced and the intense fan reaction to recent New York Jets coaching changes. Kevin Petullo’s reported demotion as offensive coordinator is mentioned, leading to extensive group chat discussions about potential offensive guru hires.
Deadpool 3 Speculation
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(00:09:16)
  • Key Takeaway: The Russo brothers tweeted cryptic clues suggesting Deadpool 3 will feature multiversal extinction-level events and potentially involve the X-Men character Cable.
  • Summary: The hosts discuss a cryptic tweet from the Russo brothers about Deadpool 3 clues and stories, leading to speculation about extinction-level events across the multiverse. They reference the X-Men character Cable, who protects a baby (Nathan Summers) in the comics and Deadpool 2.
28 Years Later: The Bone Temple Initial Reactions
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(00:11:07)
  • Key Takeaway: 28 Years Later: The Bone Temple is a brutal, funny, and visually distinct sequel that focuses on the collective psyche post-apocalypse, utilizing a different visual language than the first film.
  • Summary: The discussion begins on 28 Years Later: The Bone Temple, the fourth film in the series, directed by Nia DaCosta with a script by Alex Garland, and shot by cinematographer Sean Bobbitt. Chris Ryan praises the film, noting it works in very different ways than the original, focusing on the collective psyche after catastrophe, similar to themes in Come and See.
Film’s Violence and Structure
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(00:13:16)
  • Key Takeaway: The sequel is described as ‘pure gnarly’ and more violent than previous installments, employing classical horror structure rather than the messy risk-taking of the original.
  • Summary: The film is characterized as extremely violent, utilizing more pure viscera and horror mechanics than the previous installment, which had more action set pieces. The structure is more classical horror, though it contains significant revelations and leans into an 80s New Wave soundtrack.
Second Installment Thematic Risks
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(00:15:46)
  • Key Takeaway: As a second installment in a planned trilogy, 28 Years Later: The Bone Temple successfully takes narrative risks, shifting focus away from Spike to explore cult apparatus and scientific reason.
  • Summary: The film functions well as a second chapter, allowing for narrative risks similar to The Empire Strikes Back. It leans away from Spike’s central focus to explore the ideologies of cult leader Jimmy Crystal and Dr. Kelson, who is studying the evolution of the infected Alpha, Samson.
Jimmy Crystal and Cult Ideology
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(00:21:38)
  • Key Takeaway: Jack O’Connell’s Jimmy Crystal embodies the charismatic but insecure cult leader who exploits dire situations, echoing real-world demagogues.
  • Summary: Jimmy Crystal is portrayed as a fascinating, vile cult leader who claims divine communication, contrasting sharply with Dr. Kelson’s scientific approach. O’Connell finds pathos in the character, showing flashes of insecurity beneath his command over his flock.
Dr. Kelson’s Scientific Quest
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(00:27:07)
  • Key Takeaway: Dr. Kelson represents science and reason, attempting to find an evolution or treatment for the virus by studying the increasingly humanized Alpha, Samson, using opiates.
  • Summary: Dr. Kelson, portrayed by Ralph Fiennes, is a sincere, lonely scientist trying to understand the virus’s evolution, evidenced by his study of the Alpha, Samson, who regains humanity after being treated with morphine. The film subtly references the depletion of man-made resources like drugs, symbolized by poppies appearing in the final scene.
Ralph Fiennes’ Performance
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(00:31:42)
  • Key Takeaway: Ralph Fiennes is celebrated as one of the most daring and flexible post-movie stars, demonstrating remarkable physical freedom and musicality in his role as Dr. Kelson.
  • Summary: Fiennes is lauded for his ability to handle complex material, showcasing freedom with his body through dance movements while portraying Kelson. His contrast with O’Connell’s performance in their central confrontation highlights the film’s thematic collision between faith/demagoguery and science/reason.
Killian Murphy’s Return and Thematic Coda
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(00:36:43)
  • Key Takeaway: Killian Murphy returns as the character from the first film, teaching his daughter about history, specifically the conciliatory post-WWII approach, suggesting Garland’s theme against vindictive punishment.
  • Summary: The return of Cillian Murphy’s character involves him teaching his daughter about the historical lesson of post-WWII reconciliation over post-WWI vindictiveness, a key thematic point from Garland. This return was met with applause and sets up the final confrontation.
The Devil Performance Set Piece
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(00:38:00)
  • Key Takeaway: Dr. Kelson stages an elaborate performance as the Devil for Jimmy Crystal’s minions, set to Iron Maiden’s ‘Number of the Beast,’ culminating in an epic fire dance.
  • Summary: Kelson performs as the Dark Lord, using simulated drugs and set to Iron Maiden, in a visually exciting sequence that baffles Jimmy’s followers. This performance concludes with a dramatic fire dance, followed by a crucifixion in the aftermath.
Franchise Trajectory and Future
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(00:40:14)
  • Key Takeaway: The 28 franchise is considered creatively invigorating, with the trilogy structure providing comfort that the coda serves a narrative purpose rather than just setting up the next installment.
  • Summary: The hosts believe this running franchise is currently the most creatively invigorating in movies, appreciating the way the story concludes its arc before a brief coda. The fact that Garland wrote three scripts eases concerns about the ending feeling like an abrupt setup for a sequel.
Ralph Fiennes Hall of Fame
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(00:44:42)
  • Key Takeaway: Ralph Fiennes’ essential performances include Schindler’s List, The Grand Budapest Hotel, The Constant Gardener, and his roles in the 28 franchise.
  • Summary: The hosts compile a preliminary list of Ralph Fiennes’ essential performances, including stone-cold locks like Schindler’s List and The Grand Budapest Hotel. Other strong contenders mentioned are In Bruges, Hail Caesar, The Hurt Locker, and Quiz Show, highlighting his ability to impact films regardless of his billing.
The Testament of Ann Lee Initial Thoughts
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(00:52:34)
  • Key Takeaway: The Testament of Ann Lee is a complex biopic musical detailing the rise of spiritual leader Ann Lee and the Shaker movement, featuring ecstatic, memorable choreography.
  • Summary: The film chronicles Ann Lee’s journey from obscurity in 18th-century England and America, founding the radical Shaker movement inspired by the Quakers. The narrative focuses on her personal tragedy leading to the concept of celibacy combined with convulsive musical worship. The choreography and movement, literalizing the ‘shaking Quakers,’ were a major highlight.
Shaker Movement and Ecstatic Dance
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(00:54:56)
  • Key Takeaway: The choreography and music in ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ synchronize to literalize the Shaker’s ecstatic dance, creating a transfixing emotional hysteria that director Mona Fastvold portrays without irony.
  • Summary: The film incorporates traditional Shaker music and strange dancing, fitting the choreography to the filmmaking style where camera and story movements mirror the Shakers. This approach captures the emotional hysteria of the movement, which is alien to 21st-century sensibilities but presented as a sincere portrait. The ecstatic sequences communicate the desperate and consuming nature of this expression.
Trauma and Healing Themes
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(00:57:03)
  • Key Takeaway: Both ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ and ‘The Brutalist’ address healing from deep personal trauma, such as rape, through construction, imagination, and community, rather than offering simple happy endings.
  • Summary: Raw portrayals of childbirth and infant death in the film are severe and may alienate some viewers, reflecting inspiration points for Ann Lee’s worldview. Her tenuous relationship with sex, stemming from family abuse, informs her thinking on celibacy. The film avoids cheapening the narrative by simply labeling events as trauma leading to healing; instead, it focuses on the characters’ attempts to work through their experiences.
Amanda Seyfried’s Performance
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(00:58:54)
  • Key Takeaway: Amanda Seyfried’s performance in ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ is considered ‘God tier work’ due to the extreme demands of embodying spiritual ideology, fearless leadership, singing, dancing, and enduring prosthetics and violence.
  • Summary: The role required Seyfried to maintain a clear sense of spiritual ideology while representing ecstatic devotion, singing, and leading complex choreography. Her sincerity is noted, especially in contrast to roles where she might wink at the audience, such as in ‘The Housemaid.’ The film’s ending portrayal of Ann Lee is described as interesting, mature, and complicated.
Film’s Uniqueness and Comparison
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(01:00:01)
  • Key Takeaway: ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ feels like a collision between the artistic concerns of ‘Vox Lux’ and ‘The Brutalist,’ focusing on how music, performance, artistry, pain, and spirituality intersect.
  • Summary: The film is considered unusual and may make general audiences uncomfortable or bored due to its lack of the triumphal quality found in the first half of ‘The Brutalist.’ It is a speculative portrait that does not rely on easy comparisons to other films due to its unique structure and forced musical approach. The music by Daniel Blumberg is noted as being easy to return to on Spotify.
Development and Shaker Research
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(01:02:50)
  • Key Takeaway: Mona Fastvold discovered the Shakers while researching hymns for a different project, leading to the realization that Ann Lee’s radical, feminist ideas and ecstatic worship style were highly cinematic.
  • Summary: The script for ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ was written before ‘The Brutalist,’ though similarities became apparent during editing. Fastvold found the hymn ‘Pretty Mother’s Home’ while researching for a film set in 1856, which led her to Ann Lee and the Shakers. She was surprised by how radical and feminist Lee’s ideas on justice and equality were, finding the worship through ecstatic song and dance inherently cinematic.
Speculative Retelling and Filmmaker Parallel
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(01:06:24)
  • Key Takeaway: The film is a ‘speculative retelling’ because Ann Lee was illiterate, meaning historical accounts are interpretations by witnesses, allowing the filmmakers to write from intuition and dialogue with the material.
  • Summary: The drive and ambition required to pursue Ann Lee’s vision mirror the struggle of independent filmmaking, where creators face constant rejection but persist due to deep belief. Fastvold attributes her defiance to believing so strongly in the story that she cannot stop making the movie, even when facing ’no’s.’ She seeks singular, precise visions that eventually find an appetite in the market.
Tone and Filmmaking Philosophy
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(01:11:41)
  • Key Takeaway: Fastvold chose a serious, non-ironic tone for ‘The Testament of Ann Lee’ to treat Ann Lee with respect and radical seriousness, contrasting the film’s linear structure with its radical filmmaking techniques.
  • Summary: It was difficult to avoid making fun of Ann Lee, but the hard route was treating her seriously, which felt more radical. The script uses a traditional three-act structure, allowing the radical elements—movement, music, and editing—to bring the unconventional nature. Fastvold felt compelled to present Ann Lee’s entire life as a grand gesture, driven by love and community-building rather than ego or manipulation.
Execution of Music and Movement
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(01:17:04)
  • Key Takeaway: The music and choreography were developed concurrently with the script, with a mandate that the diegetic world’s sounds (like slaps and breath work) must remain present within the score, never being overtaken by traditional music.
  • Summary: Specific movements, like the circular spinning in ‘Beautiful Treasures,’ are written to intercut with scenes of birth and loss, mapping years of life onto one dance sequence. Daniel Blumberg’s score initially focused only on bells, breath work, and percussion to integrate the physical sounds of the sect. The goal was to ensure the music was a conversation between Daniel Blumberg’s style and the Shaker tradition, not a separate layer.
Low-Budget Epic Filmmaking
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(01:22:55)
  • Key Takeaway: Achieving epic scale on a lower budget involves combining old techniques, like traditional matte painting by Lee Took, with modern VFX to create a desired painterly, organic look that feels handmade.
  • Summary: The team obsessed over craftsmanship, with actors learning woodworking from Shaker village interpreters. For the ship sequence, a real tall ship was used, but the surroundings were hand-painted by a matte artist and married to the live footage using VFX to avoid massive CG builds. This hybrid approach ensures the film feels like crawling into a painting while still utilizing future technology.
Collaboration with Amanda Seyfried
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(01:30:07)
  • Key Takeaway: Amanda Seyfried prepared for the role of Ann Lee for a year, working diligently to master the difficult accent, movement, and singing, requiring her to ‘unlearn’ traditional musical theater performance for truthful expression.
  • Summary: Directing Seyfried was easy because they spoke the same language, and she cared as much as Fastvold, giving her all to the role. She worked on the accent for a year and was coached to focus on intent in movement rather than perfect choreography, aiming for ‘movement’ over ‘dancing.’ Fastvold confirmed the film could potentially be adapted into a stage musical due to the exciting music and choreography.
Filmmaking Philosophy and Distribution
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(01:36:51)
  • Key Takeaway: Mona Fastvold prioritizes maintaining autonomy and a specific philosophy regarding community and economy on set, even while securing distribution from a major studio like Searchlight Pictures for ‘The Testament of Ann Lee.’
  • Summary: Fastvold intends to always make movies the way she wants, valuing the unity and lack of negative hierarchy within her small production community. She feels a responsibility for the financial sustainability of her radical stories, preferring to keep budgets reasonable to ensure the project makes sense economically. She enjoys the space between European and American filmmaking traditions, nodding to Hollywood grandeur while maintaining independent execution.