The Diary Of A CEO with Steven Bartlett

CIA Whistleblower: They Can See All Your Messages! I Was Under Surveillance In Pakistan!

January 19, 2026

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  • The CIA actively seeks to hire individuals with sociopathic tendencies, as they are more likely to operate in legal, moral, and ethical gray areas necessary for covert operations. 
  • The primary motivation for 95% of individuals recruited as spies is financial, with love, ideology, revenge, and excitement accounting for the remaining 5%. 
  • Intelligence agencies possess the capability to remotely control devices like smart TVs and car computer systems, and billions of dollars are now spent spying on American citizens, a practice that was illegal prior to 9/11. 
  • The CIA historically engaged in unethical and illegal activities, such as the MKUltra program involving LSD experimentation on unwitting citizens, and the term "conspiracy theory" was coined by a former CIA director to discredit critics. 
  • The Israeli intelligence services (Mossad and Shinbet) are considered highly impressive due to their ruthless operational methods, such as the simultaneous pager bombing attack against Hezbollah, and their aggressive counterintelligence efforts against the US. 
  • The guest strongly believes Jeffrey Epstein was an Israeli spy acting as an 'access agent' to compromise high-level American politicians, and he views China, with its patient, long-term economic strategy, as the West's true adversary, warning the US is spending itself into bankruptcy. 

Segments

CIA Surveillance Capabilities Revealed
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(00:01:00)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA can remotely control a car’s computer system to cause crashes and turn off smart TVs into active microphones.
  • Summary: Billions are spent spying on Americans by agencies like the NSA, CIA, and FBI. CIA capabilities include remotely crashing vehicles or using turned-off smart TVs as active microphones broadcasting back to the agency. This information became public via the Vault 7 documents leaked by a disgruntled CIA software engineer.
Whistleblowing and Ethics
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(00:01:46)
  • Key Takeaway: John Kiriakou would willingly go to prison again for exposing the CIA’s torture program because it was illegal, immoral, and untrue that torture worked.
  • Summary: Kiriakou spent 15 years in the CIA but blew the whistle on the torture program due to ethical concerns. He maintains he is not remorseful and would face prison time again for exposing the program’s ineffectiveness and immorality. He notes that the CIA has experimented on American citizens and spread diseases in American cities.
Adversaries and Epstein Question
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(00:02:15)
  • Key Takeaway: John Kiriakou believes Jeffrey Epstein was working for the Israelis.
  • Summary: Kiriakou was asked about his primary concerns regarding the West’s adversaries and current global events. He confirmed his belief that Jeffrey Epstein was a spy working for the Israelis.
Kiriakou’s Fame and Prison
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(00:03:24)
  • Key Takeaway: Kiriakou’s public notoriety stems from his nationally televised interview exposing the CIA’s torture program, for which he served 23 months.
  • Summary: Kiriakou attributes his name recognition to blowing the whistle on the CIA’s torture program in a televised interview. He affirmed he would do it again, stating he is not remorseful or contrite about his actions. He was imprisoned for exposing the program.
CIA Role and Counterterrorism
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(00:04:43)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA’s basic function is to recruit spies, steal secrets, and analyze them for policymakers, with counterterrorism operations focusing on disrupting organizations like Al-Qaeda.
  • Summary: Kiriakou served 15 years, starting in analysis before moving to counterterrorism operations, including leading operations in Pakistan post-9/11. His operational goal was to recruit Al-Qaeda members to preempt attacks. Analyst work involved writing high-level briefings, such as the President’s Daily Brief (PDB), for top officials.
Asset Acquisition Cycle Explained
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(00:08:36)
  • Key Takeaway: Recruiting spies follows the asset acquisition cycle: spot, assess, develop, and recruit, often initiated by identifying a target’s professional relevance.
  • Summary: Recruitment involves spotting potential assets based on their access to secrets, assessing their suitability, and then developing a relationship. Kiriakou detailed developing a relationship with an Al-Qaeda fighter by becoming a regular at his coffee shop and building rapport over several weeks. The asset was ultimately recruited by offering to help him return home to his family in Cairo.
Path to Becoming a Spy
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(00:13:33)
  • Key Takeaway: Kiriakou was recruited into the CIA after a professor, who was an undercover CIA officer, graded his psychological profile paper highly.
  • Summary: Kiriakou’s path began with an assignment in a ‘Psychology of Leadership’ class where he profiled his union boss as a sociopath. The professor, Dr. Gerald Post, revealed himself as a CIA officer and recruited Kiriakou based on this assessment. The recruitment process was immediate, involving a test at the GW University Medical School auditorium.
CIA Strategy with Podcasters
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(00:14:47)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA is developing a strategy for podcasters, similar to its established liaison with Hollywood, to disseminate specific, well-honed messages.
  • Summary: The CIA now has a dedicated branch liaising with Hollywood to ensure pro-CIA narratives in films, a practice the FBI has done since the 1940s. Kiriakou believes the CIA is now developing a similar strategy for podcasters to push specific messages, such as supporting or criticizing political figures or entities. The effectiveness relies on the message being repeated enough times to influence the audience.
CIA Training: Lying and Vulnerabilities
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(00:26:24)
  • Key Takeaway: CIA training emphasizes operating in legal and moral gray areas, and recruitment targets vulnerabilities, with 95% of recruits motivated by money.
  • Summary: The CIA seeks people with sociopathic tendencies who can operate outside normal moral constraints, which is also common among CEOs. The primary ‘hook’ for recruitment is a vulnerability, though 95% of spies are motivated by money, with the rest motivated by love, ideology, revenge, or excitement.
Incentives and Domestic Operations
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(00:32:13)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA can offer virtually anything, including legal favors like green cards, for high-value information, but generally does not recruit American citizens domestically.
  • Summary: For valuable intelligence, the CIA can arrange for incentives like making tax bills disappear or securing green cards, though they typically do not recruit US citizens domestically due to legal restrictions. Domestic CIA offices primarily debrief US business leaders returning from foreign ‘denied areas’ to gather intelligence.
Taking One for the Team
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(00:37:34)
  • Key Takeaway: While sleeping with assets is against CIA rules and results in penalty, coercion like sex extortion is generally ineffective compared to relationships built on mutual trust.
  • Summary: Kiriakou recounted an instance where his boss suggested he sleep with an asset, though he ultimately did not, noting that sleeping with assets leads to being pulled back to the US. He stated that threatening or coercing sources, like using sex extortion, is generally ineffective compared to building relationships based on mutual trust, a tactic favored by the Russians and Israelis.
Average Person’s Ignorance of Reality
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(00:42:09)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA has historically missed major global developments, and due to metadata sales, the average American commits three felonies daily, making them vulnerable to prosecution.
  • Summary: Kiriakou asserts that the CIA is not as smart or worldly as perceived, having missed major global events since 1947. Since 9/11, spying on Americans has become widespread, and metadata is easily purchased without a warrant. Professor Harvey Silverglate’s research suggests the average American commits three felonies daily, creating vulnerability if authorities decide to target them.
Digital Security Warnings
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(00:47:18)
  • Key Takeaway: All personal devices are insecure against numerous global intelligence agencies, and anything said or written can be taken out of context to target an individual.
  • Summary: Kiriakou warns that devices are not secure, as capabilities exist for many nations (including the US, UK, China, Russia, etc.) to intercept communications. The Vault 7 documents revealed the CIA’s ability to hack cars and use TVs as microphones even when powered off. He advises against saying or doing anything one would be ashamed to see on the front page of the Washington Post.
Sleeper Agents Explained
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(00:52:52)
  • Key Takeaway: Sleeper agents are individuals raised from childhood by foreign powers (like Russia) to believe they are American, only to be activated years later for espionage.
  • Summary: Sleeper agents are trained from birth in a foreign country to adopt a target nation’s culture, language, and references, often using the identity of a deceased infant. They can be activated decades later to perform espionage tasks, such as assassinations or stealing secrets. The realization of their true identity often occurs only after they have established a family in the target country.
Prevalence of Foreign Spies
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(00:57:33)
  • Key Takeaway: There are an estimated 50,000 to 60,000 foreign and domestic intelligence officers operating in the United States, making encounters statistically likely for those in defense industries.
  • Summary: Kiriakou estimates 50,000 to 60,000 spies operate in the US, meaning the average person statistically meets one undercover operative annually. For anyone working at American defense contractors like Lockheed Martin or Boeing, the chance of encountering a foreign intelligence officer is even money. The primary foreign intelligence threats targeting the US are identified as Russian, Chinese, and Israeli.
Post-9/11 Budget and Rewards
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(01:01:07)
  • Key Takeaway: After 9/11, counterterrorism budgets became virtually unlimited, leading to the payment of $25 million to an individual for high-value intelligence.
  • Summary: Following 9/11, budgets for counterterrorism operations were essentially unlimited, allowing for massive payouts for actionable intelligence. Kiriakou confirmed paying $10 million to the Pakistani Intelligence Service for the capture of Abu Zubaydah. One individual received $25 million for providing information on a high-ranking foreign terrorist, necessitating relocation to a country like Dubai.
High-Value Informant Payments (Unknown)
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  • Key Takeaway: None
  • Summary: None
CIA Mind Control and MKUltra
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(01:04:43)
  • Key Takeaway: The CIA initiated the MKUltra program using LSD experimentally on employees and strangers after being misled by Chinese disinformation regarding Russian mind control efforts.
  • Summary: The term ‘conspiracy theory’ was created by a former CIA director to discredit genuine revelations like MKUltra, Operation Grasshopper, and MKChickwit. The CIA began dosing employees with LSD, leading to suicides, before moving to dosing strangers in public as part of Operation Midnight Climax. The director of the CIA ordered the mass destruction of MKUltra files in 1973, despite being explicitly told not to by the Church Committee.
CIA Involvement in Iran (Unknown)
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  • Key Takeaway: None
  • Summary: None
Guest’s Experience with Killing
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(01:11:50)
  • Key Takeaway: The guest provided intelligence that led to a US missile strike in Iraq that killed a janitor, an event that caused him lasting guilt despite his boss absolving him.
  • Summary: The guest has never intentionally taken an action resulting in death, but he feels responsible for the death of a janitor in Baghdad. He provided the address of the Iraqi Intelligence Service director to General Powell, who subsequently ordered 47 cruise missiles to strike the headquarters. The strike occurred at night, resulting in the death of the janitor instead of the intended target.
US Assassination Program Details
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(01:14:23)
  • Key Takeaway: During the Obama administration, John Brennan initiated ‘Tuesday morning kill list meetings’ involving the NSC and CIA to authorize the killing of ground-level terrorists globally.
  • Summary: The US continues to carry out assassinations via the CIA, often targeting ground-level terrorists rather than world leaders. The legal standard for these strikes—posing a ‘clear and present danger’—is vague and relies on the word of the operatives returning from missions. The guest believes the US is moving from a unipolar to a multipolar world following the snatching of Venezuelan President Maduro.
Impressiveness of Israeli Intelligence
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(01:15:48)
  • Key Takeaway: The Israeli intelligence services are the most impressive because they operate without rules, exemplified by the illegal but genius pager operation that decapitated Hezbollah leadership.
  • Summary: The Israelis are considered the most impressive spy force because they are willing to kill anyone and disregard international law, as demonstrated by the pager operation. They bought a pager manufacturing company to insert explosives, activating them simultaneously to kill Hezbollah leadership. They also do not hesitate to destroy entire city blocks to eliminate a single target.
Jeffrey Epstein as an Israeli Spy
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(01:22:16)
  • Key Takeaway: The guest is confident Jeffrey Epstein was an Israeli spy, noting his role as a stereotypical ‘access agent’ used to gather compromising material (‘compromat’) on powerful figures.
  • Summary: Epstein fits the profile of an ‘access agent’ recruited to gain close proximity to figures like former presidents and royalty whom foreign intelligence cannot directly recruit. His island house contained hidden cameras in every room, including bathrooms, suggesting the collection of compromising material for extortion. The sweetheart plea deal in 2006 suggests powerful protection, possibly related to his espionage activities.
China’s Long-Term Adversary Strategy
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(01:27:41)
  • Key Takeaway: China is the primary adversary due to its patient, long-term planning (25-year timelines) focused on stealing technology via students and gaining global influence through infrastructure investment rather than military invasion.
  • Summary: Unlike the US’s short-term election cycles, China plans decades ahead, making them highly effective in technology theft, often utilizing PhD students in hard sciences. China is effectively ‘owning Africa’ by funding infrastructure projects like highways and airports using its massive trade surplus. This strategy allows them to undermine the US while the US spends trillions on its military budget, potentially leading to US bankruptcy.
Government Lawlessness and Whistleblowing
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(01:37:05)
  • Key Takeaway: The US government broke its own laws by legalizing torture in 2002, reversing a standard where waterboarding previously resulted in a 20-year prison sentence for a US soldier in 1968.
  • Summary: The guest blew the whistle on the torture program because the US government changed its behavior, not the law, making torture legal in 2002 when it was previously banned by the Federal Torture Act. In 1968, a soldier who waterboarded a prisoner received 20 years, but by 2002, the CIA operated secret prisons with foreign partners using US funds. The guest’s revelations led to the McCain-Feinstein anti-torture amendment in 2014.
Life Improvement Through Action
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(01:41:42)
  • Key Takeaway: The most significant improvement in the guest’s life came from stopping the habit of feeling sorry for himself after his divorce and subsequent felony conviction.
  • Summary: After facing unemployment and financial hardship in his 50s, the guest decided to reject self-pity and pursue a career as a writer and storyteller. He realized that since he believed his whistleblowing was correct, he should not feel like a loser while others were criminals. This decision allowed him to build a successful new career outside of government or corporate structures.