Call Her Daddy

Shonda Rhimes: Women Need To Brag More

October 8, 2025

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  • Shonda Rhimes moved from Los Angeles to Connecticut to escape the constant attention and feeling that everyone wanted something from her, finding relief in the anonymity of her new town. 
  • Shonda Rhimes credits her early success, including *Grey's Anatomy*, to being naive about the industry and focusing on learning rather than pretending to know everything, which she advises young professionals to embrace. 
  • The creation of *Grey's Anatomy* was prompted by a network request for a medical show, and the initial idea for Christina Yang's character included an abortion storyline that was ultimately changed to an ectopic pregnancy due to network concerns. 
  • Shonda Rhimes believes women struggle to accept compliments and brag due to societal conditioning that encourages them to be quieter and adjust themselves, fearing they will be perceived as arrogant. 
  • Rhimes' creative process involves extensive mental development of ideas over long periods before committing anything to paper, leading her to reject the concept of writer's block as merely being stuck on a problem. 
  • Success often amplifies pre-existing personality traits, and for women, achieving success can be isolating if their friends are invested in a shared negative worldview and are threatened by the change in self-perception. 

Segments

Podcast Announcement and Ad Reads
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(00:00:00)
  • Key Takeaway: The host announces the podcast joining the SiriusXM family and promotes sponsors Sam Edelman and BetMGM.
  • Summary: The host greets the ‘Daddy Gang,’ announces the move to SiriusXM, and encourages ad-free subscriptions. This is followed by advertisements for Sam Edelman boots and BetMGM sports betting.
Guest Introduction and Excitement
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(00:01:55)
  • Key Takeaway: The host expresses immense excitement for having Shonda Rhimes on the show, noting the overwhelmingly positive reaction from others.
  • Summary: Alex Cooper welcomes Shonda Rhimes to the ‘Call Her Daddy’ podcast. Rhimes notes the excitement surrounding her appearance, and Cooper confirms the positive vibes.
Shonda’s Current Projects and Gray’s Milestone
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(00:02:35)
  • Key Takeaway: Shonda Rhimes is promoting the 10th Anniversary Edition of ‘Year of Yes’ and celebrating the 450th episode of ‘Gray’s Anatomy.’
  • Summary: Rhimes mentions she is promoting her book and celebrating the 450th episode of ‘Gray’s Anatomy,’ reflecting on how long the show has been a part of her life.
Life Change: LA vs. Connecticut
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(00:03:25)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes moved to Connecticut during the pandemic and prefers the anonymity and lack of industry pressure there, contrasting it with her previous life in LA.
  • Summary: They discuss Rhimes’ move to Connecticut after nearly 30 years in LA. She expresses shock that she doesn’t miss LA, enjoying the normalcy of going to Costco without being recognized.
Fame and Anonymity Differences
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(00:04:39)
  • Key Takeaway: Being famous in LA means people often want something from you, whereas in Connecticut, people are less concerned with industry status.
  • Summary: The conversation contrasts how celebrities are treated in LA versus Connecticut. Rhimes notes that in LA, people approach her hoping for career opportunities, leading her to become a recluse at times.
Shonda’s Early Writing Career
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(00:05:17)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes is recognized as an influential showrunner, and the discussion reveals she wrote ‘The Princess Diaries 2’ and ‘Crossroads’ before ‘Gray’s Anatomy.’
  • Summary: Cooper praises Rhimes’ influence. They discuss her early screenwriting work, including ‘The Princess Diaries 2’ and the Britney Spears movie ‘Crossroads.’ Rhimes recalls the fun experience of writing for Julie Andrews.
Rapid Fire: Favorite Characters and Crisis Calls
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(00:07:36)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes would switch lives with Christina Yang (but date neither Burke nor Owen) and would call Olivia Pope first in a crisis.
  • Summary: They play ‘Shondaland Rapid Fire.’ Rhimes chooses Christina Yang, rejects both Burke and Owen, and selects Olivia Pope for crisis management over Meredith Gray or Annalise Keating.
Iconic Dialogue and Early Writing Process
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(00:08:45)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes doesn’t have a favorite line of dialogue, emphasizing that ‘Gray’s Anatomy’ was her first TV writing experience where she was learning as she went.
  • Summary: Rhimes states she doesn’t have a favorite line, explaining that when writing ‘Gray’s Anatomy,’ she was learning TV writing and simply writing what she wanted to watch, not aiming for iconic moments.
Bridgerton and Favorite TV Moments
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(00:09:30)
  • Key Takeaway: The most romantic ‘Bridgerton’ moment was ‘I burn for you’ from Season 1, and Rhimes would rather intern at Seattle Grace than Olivia Pope and Associates.
  • Summary: They discuss the most romantic ‘Bridgerton’ moment and ask Rhimes to choose between interning at Seattle Grace or Olivia Pope and Associates (she chose Seattle Grace).
Hypochondria from Writing Medical Dramas
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(00:09:47)
  • Key Takeaway: Writing ‘Gray’s Anatomy’ made Rhimes a hypochondriac convinced she could perform surgery, even offering to do C-sections.
  • Summary: Rhimes admits to becoming a terrible hypochondriac after writing about medical issues, even believing she could perform an appendectomy. They also discuss the memorable ‘hiccups’ death storyline.
Stolen Set Props and Friendships
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(00:10:37)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes admits to taking the Resolute desk (Fitz’s desk from ‘Scandal’) and other meaningful items from sets, and her closest actor friend is Scott Foley.
  • Summary: Rhimes confesses to taking the Resolute desk from the ‘Scandal’ set, which is currently in storage. She names Scott Foley (Jake Ballard) as her closest actor friend, noting they now live in the same town.
Early Career Ambitions and Feeling Lost
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(00:12:22)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes wanted to be a doctor or lawyer as a child but realized she just wanted to research and pretend, feeling lost after graduating from Dartmouth.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses her childhood desire to be a writer, contrasting it with wanting to be a doctor or lawyer. She recalls sobbing after graduating from Dartmouth because she was lost and didn’t have a job lined up.
Advice for the Lost in Their 20s
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(00:17:03)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes advises young people to pursue their dreams while they are young and can afford to be broke, as it never gets easier later.
  • Summary: Rhimes shares advice for those feeling lost in their 20s: pursue your dreams now while you can afford to be broke, because responsibilities accumulate later, making the jump harder.
Origin of Gray’s Anatomy
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(00:19:01)
  • Key Takeaway: The idea for ‘Gray’s Anatomy’ stemmed from Rhimes wanting to write complex character development on TV after having her daughter, and ABC requesting a medical show.
  • Summary: Rhimes explains that after having her daughter, she realized TV offered better character development than movies. After a failed pilot about war correspondents, ABC asked for a medical show, which aligned with her past interest in attending medical school.
Day One in the Writer’s Room
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(00:21:25)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes was thrilled by the physical set (the operating room) but terrified by the responsibility of leading 300 people as a shy introvert.
  • Summary: Rhimes describes the excitement of seeing the built operating room set. The biggest lesson learned was to never pretend to know something; she embraced being lost and learning from her team.
Airbnb Ad Read
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(00:23:36)
  • Key Takeaway: The host shares a personal story about planning a surprise romantic trip for her fiancé using Airbnb.
  • Summary: The host details planning a surprise trip to a ranch house via Airbnb, enjoying nature, hiking, and having privacy, jokingly challenging her fiancé’s title as the ‘most romantic one.’
YSL Beauty: Abuse Warning Signs
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(00:25:06)
  • Key Takeaway: The podcast partners with YSL Beauty to list nine warning signs of relationship abuse: ignoring, blackmailing, humiliation, manipulation, jealousy, control, intrusion, isolation, and intimidation.
  • Summary: The host shifts to a serious topic, partnering with YSL Beauty’s ‘Abuse Is Not Love’ campaign. She lists the nine key warning signs of unhealthy relationships and directs listeners to the hotline for resources.
Casting Meredith Gray and Christina Yang
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(00:26:05)
  • Key Takeaway: Ellen Pompeo (Meredith Gray) was chosen based on her role in ‘Moonlight Mile’ without an audition, while Sandra Oh (Christina Yang) initially auditioned for Dr. Bailey.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses casting, noting T.R. Knight was an early favorite. She sought someone who felt like the girl in ‘Moonlight Mile’ for Meredith Gray. Sandra Oh impressed everyone reading for Dr. Bailey but Rhimes knew she was Christina Yang.
Hardest Storylines to Write Emotionally
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(00:28:48)
  • Key Takeaway: Killing Denny Duquette was the hardest early emotional storyline, and the plane crash episode (Lexie and Mark’s deaths) was horrifying to revisit later.
  • Summary: Rhimes found killing Denny Duquette the hardest emotionally because it was the first major loss. She also found revisiting the plane crash episode horrifying, emphasizing her role is to be true to the story, not the fans.
Embodying ‘Cannot Be What You Cannot See’
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(00:32:08)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes intentionally writes complex, diverse women because she grew up watching female characters relegated to simplistic roles (vamp, mom, sidekick).
  • Summary: Rhimes explains that her shows feature a vast array of women because she never saw herself reflected in media growing up, where female characters lacked complexity.
Inspiration for Olivia Pope
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(00:34:02)
  • Key Takeaway: Olivia Pope is based on real-life DC fixer Judy Smith, whose job description fascinated Rhimes and inspired the show ‘Scandal.’
  • Summary: Rhimes details meeting Judy Smith, which immediately sparked the idea for ‘Scandal.’ She was drawn to the concept of a crisis manager, especially after dealing with behind-the-scenes drama on ‘Gray’s Anatomy.’
Network Pushback on Sensitive Topics
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(00:35:34)
  • Key Takeaway: The network pushed back on Olivia Pope having an abortion, but Rhimes countered by pointing out a similar, less controversial scene involving a different character having an abortion earlier in the show.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses network pushback on sensitive storylines. She notes they initially discouraged Christina Yang’s abortion storyline, but the pushback on Olivia Pope’s abortion was stronger, which she navigated by referencing a previously aired, similar scene.
Overcoming Fear of Career Ending
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(00:39:00)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes felt her career was truly settled only in 2016 when inducted into the Television Academy Hall of Fame, though she now wishes she had enjoyed the earlier, unstable success more.
  • Summary: Rhimes admits she lived in fear that ‘Gray’s Anatomy’ would end for years, pushing herself constantly. She only felt secure after her Hall of Fame induction, though she now realizes that instability may have fueled her drive.
Pressure of Controlling Thursday Night TV
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(00:41:06)
  • Key Takeaway: When given control of ABC’s entire Thursday night lineup, Rhimes was simultaneously negotiating her contract, realizing her immense power only in the moment she walked on stage with Viola Davis.
  • Summary: Rhimes recalls the pressure of taking over Thursday night programming. She was focused on contract negotiations right up until she walked out on stage with Viola Davis, realizing the scope of her power in that moment.
Learning Business and Leadership Skills
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(00:42:30)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes learned business skills out of necessity, recognizing that industry players often prefer women not understand their power, which she countered by learning the business side.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses learning to be a businesswoman and leader, noting that many people don’t want powerful women to understand the industry ropes. She learned to lead by acknowledging what she didn’t know and surrounding herself with experts.
Creative Inspiration and Process
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(00:47:47)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes’ creative process starts either with a line of dialogue (like ‘It’s handled’ for ‘Scandal’) or a specific character dynamic, such as the difficulty of being a female surgeon balancing life.
  • Summary: Rhimes explains that inspiration can come from a single line or a character concept. For ‘Gray’s Anatomy,’ the idea solidified after hearing a resident describe the difficulty of shaving her legs in the hospital bathrooms, highlighting the messy reality of the characters’ lives.
Creative Process and Inspiration
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(00:48:25)
  • Key Takeaway: Creative inspiration often comes from observing the nuanced, unglamorous realities of women’s lives, such as a medical resident struggling to shave in hospital bathrooms.
  • Summary: The discussion starts with Shonda Rhimes explaining how she finds inspiration, citing the specific challenges faced by female surgeons as a catalyst for her writing. She then describes her current ‘build phase’ of gathering ideas for new shows.
Rhimes’ Unique Writing Process
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(00:50:00)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes relies on extensive mental conceptualization for a year or more before writing a draft in just a couple of days, rejecting the concept of writer’s block.
  • Summary: Rhimes details her creative process, emphasizing that she rarely writes anything down until she is ready for the final draft. She explains that she doesn’t believe in writer’s block, viewing stalled periods as necessary thinking time.
Disbelief in Career Milestones
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(00:54:15)
  • Key Takeaway: Despite being the highest-paid showrunner, Rhimes struggled to internalize the achievement, suggesting that success doesn’t change one’s core self or habits.
  • Summary: Rhimes recounts the difficulty she had accepting the news that she was TV’s highest-paid showrunner in 2018, feeling it was hard to own publicly due to an underlying sense of not quite believing it.
Men Brag, Women Hide
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(00:57:25)
  • Key Takeaway: Women are conditioned to hide accomplishments and struggle to accept compliments due to the fear of being perceived as arrogant, unlike men who brag easily.
  • Summary: The host introduces Rhimes’ quote: ‘men brag and women hide.’ They discuss why women struggle to celebrate themselves, linking it to societal conditioning that encourages women to be quieter and adjust themselves to gain acceptance.
Being Direct vs. Being a Bitch
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(01:01:25)
  • Key Takeaway: Women face a double standard where directness is praised in men but criticized in women; Rhimes advocates for being direct and strong without being cruel.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses the pressure to avoid seeming ‘bossy’ or ‘a bitch’ in leadership roles. She encourages women to be direct and own their competence, noting that people often respect honesty over ambiguity.
The Year of Yes Transformation
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(01:03:22)
  • Key Takeaway: Saying yes to things that scared her, including difficult conversations and self-care, fundamentally changed Rhimes’ life and identity over the course of one year.
  • Summary: Rhimes explains the origin of her book, The Year of Yes, which involved saying yes to everything that scared her because her real life didn’t match the exciting lives of her characters.
Shedding People Through Growth
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(01:06:56)
  • Key Takeaway: Fundamental personal change can cause relationships to shift or end, as some people are invested only in the version of you that remains unhappy or stagnant.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses the painful realization that some loyal friends fell away when she started changing her outlook, as they were comfortable in the shared negative ecosystem.
Embracing Failure as a Lesson
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(01:10:37)
  • Key Takeaway: Failures are necessary parts of the journey, and embracing them—rather than feeling shame—is crucial for growth.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses the lesson learned from saying yes to opportunities that included failure, emphasizing that she tries to embrace failures as lessons learned rather than something to hide.
Changing Views on Marriage
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(01:14:28)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes realized her previous aversion to marriage was rooted in feeling that society valued her relationship status over her professional accomplishments.
  • Summary: Rhimes explains that she never planned to marry but felt immense pressure when engaged, realizing her value was being defined by her partner rather than her career. Now, being secure, she is open to the idea.
The Reality of Doing It All
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(01:26:50)
  • Key Takeaway: The idea that women can ‘have it all’ simultaneously is ‘bullshit’; success in one area necessitates letting another area be ‘shaky’ or less prioritized.
  • Summary: Rhimes addresses the pressure to be perfect in all roles (work and motherhood), stating that it’s impossible to be 100% present everywhere at once, and giving oneself permission to ‘fail’ in one area is freeing.
Legacy and New Avenues
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(01:29:03)
  • Key Takeaway: Rhimes hopes her legacy is creating enough space so that future women blazing trails do not have to do it alone.
  • Summary: Rhimes discusses her legacy, hoping she has paved the way for more women to succeed without experiencing the loneliness she felt charting new territory.